Question:
just checked the amazon listing for the soundtrack cd for chamber of secrets and it says: 'music composed by john williams, music adapted and conducted by william ross'
does this mean that someone else has adapted the original score from philosophers stone??? or is this actually a john williams score?
John Williams has actually composed some enw music aswell as the original theme for this new film, but Ross also did some additional original music... :)
cool
It sounded very "Star Wars" like in places, specially on the broomstick chase.
Originally posted by Liggur
It sounded very "Star Wars" like in places, specially on the broomstick chase.
I thought that bit sounded a little like the flying bike scene from ET.
check this out about john williams and his music.
http://www.tachyon-tv.co.uk/archives/news5.htm
Originally posted by Homer J
I thought that bit sounded a little like the flying bike scene from ET.
I thought that as well
Yup - as has often been remarked on - John Williams stuff all sounds pretty much the same.
Yup - as has often been remarked on - John Williams stuff all sounds pretty much the same.
You might as well say that all Van Gogh's paintings look pretty much the same.
Any form of art created by the same person is going to have signature elements that identify the artist.
But take (for example) Close Encounters of the Third Kind, Jaws and Raiders of the Lost Ark - there is no way that you can claim those scores sound the same as each other. :nuts:
Didn't Howard Shore do the first one?
Williams repeats himself less than many of the other major composers (film and otherwise). But yes, there are the odd similarities, and a few are present in Chamber of Secrets (although having someone 'adapting' his work clouds the issue). It's a shame he's gone that route as we all know how good he is at sequels - nothing short of the best ever! Star Wars? Pah, just listen to The Empire Strikes Back. Jaws? The score to the sequel is, if anything, even better.
It's been an odd year for him though. It hasn't been said in so many words as far as I know, but I get the feeling he 'left' the AOTC project incomplete (for whatever reason). Huge chunks (it felt like 30 mins +, towards the end), were repeated from earlier scores - not even re-orchestrated - just repeated verbatim. I'm not even sure if they were re-recorded!
And then... he does the same thing on Harry Potter II, claiming he only ever intended to work a little bit on it! Very strange. Only his old pal Spielberg gets full attention for his two flicks this year.
Liggur is right... the 'broomstick chase' did feature some Star Wars quotes. It began with a bit of 'Duel of the Fates' (TPM), and finished with a touch from the Hoth Battle in Empire Strikes Back. I'd guess that Williams himself composed this piece, although it's really hard to tell what he did and what Ross finished for him (Ross has been Williams' assistant for a while, I believe).
Also check out the scene where the car follows the train track. It's musically almost identical to the scene in Superman The Movie when a young Clark Kent does the same thing running alongside a track. Is it Williams repeating himself, Williams having a musical joke, or Ross doing a little tribute? No idea, but I'd guess it's one of the latter two.
Originally posted by Captain_Chaos
Didn't Howard Shore do the first one?
He sure did.
And you may also have heard that Christopher Lee wont be reprising his role as Saruman in LOTR III. Richard Harris is tipped to replace him.
I thought the score for the Philosopher's Stone was exactly the same as Home Alone.:eek:
Originally posted by Captain_Chaos
Didn't Howard Shore do the first one?
no, he did lord of the rings, williams did potter
When I first heard his trailer music for Philosophers Stone I thought it was a piece of John Williams music from Witches of Eastwick..and the first time I listened to Howard Shores score for Fellowship of the Ring, Carter Burwells theme from Millers Crossing immediately came to mind.. a lot of composers are influenced by each other (read Marc Shaimans notes in The Addams Family soundtrack in relation for Mr. Elman)..they also have a definite musical mood per score..e.g. Danny Elfman sci-fi humour (MIB, Mars Attacks)..pretty similar, contrasts with his more 'fantasy' scores (Scrooged, Edward Scissorhands) and comic book style (Batman, Darkman, Spiderman).
John Williams Hook and Home Alone for example are more children based scores, he brings his darker side out in scores for the likes of Empire Strikes Back and Jaws..where does Harry Potter fit into all this? Depends on which one you watch..sequel or original.
John Williams has been ripping off his own music for years. A friend lent me a compilation CD of his work, and it's surprising how often the same themes crop up.
Originally posted by Whiggles
John Williams has been ripping off his own music for years. A friend lent me a compilation CD of his work, and it's surprising how often the same themes crop up.
Surprising? if you listen to a compilation CD of any composer you'd find that its de rigeur to 'rip yourself off' stylistically speaking.
Compare for example..Maurice Jarre:
Ryan's Daughter
Passage to India
Sound familiar?
Danny Elfman:
Batman Returns
Scrooged
James Horner:
A Beautiful Mind
Bi-centennial Man
Even my fiancée, who's not a movie buff, can tell an Elfman score a mile away.
Originally posted by Whiggles
John Williams has been ripping off his own music for years. A friend lent me a compilation CD of his work, and it's surprising how often the same themes crop up.
The Man is a genius! He has had the more Oscar Nominations than anyone and they were fully justified, as pointed out before a music score is an art form so there will be similaraties with his most popular peices that find there way onto compilations because there contain a certain mood that people like and find familiar.
And to use the word "ripping off"! What to you think he does, sits in his house and when Spielberg or Lucas ask for a score he goes I shan't bother i'll just use the same peice of music I used in raiders or empire?
And James Horner again:
Aliens and Star Trek II - Bizarrely similiar!
And for some reason part of the last bit of the Aliens soundtrack is in Die Hard!
As far as I'm aware, although 'quotes' have cropped up now and then, Williams has never recycled a melody or a theme. James Horner and Hans Zimmer have, although the instances have probably been exagerrated. But Morricone does it all the time - he can give you five minutes, note for note.
Originally posted by Si b
The Man is a genius! He has had the more Oscar Nominations than anyone and they were fully justified, as pointed out before a music score is an art form so there will be similaraties with his most popular peices that find there way onto compilations because there contain a certain mood that people like and find familiar.
And to use the word "ripping off"! What to you think he does, sits in his house and when Spielberg or Lucas ask for a score he goes I shan't bother i'll just use the same peice of music I used in raiders or empire?
williams is a genius. he has a style of his own, and inevitably some segments are going to remind u of other scores he has done.
likewise for other composers.
Originally posted by Si b
And to use the word "ripping off"! What to you think he does, sits in his house and when Spielberg or Lucas ask for a score he goes I shan't bother i'll just use the same peice of music I used in raiders or empire? Okay, perhaps "ripping off" was a bit too strong, but I do think he re-uses the same material a great deal. I've no idea whether he does it consciously or not, but I think that's beside the point. For me, the point is that his music is not exactly the most varied I've ever heard.
Re: the last part of the Aliens OST being in Die Hard
I can't say I've ever noticed - but it's a distinct possibility. That piece - "Bishop's Countdown" - has been used in action movie trailers for years. Most recently it was played at the end of the Minority report trailer.
I love the Die Hard music - the adaptations of Ode to Joy. Does anyone know where I can get it (cheap)?
Originally posted by Deadite666
Re: the last part of the Aliens OST being in Die Hard
I can't say I've ever noticed - but it's a distinct possibility. That piece - "Bishop's Countdown" - has been used in action movie trailers for years. Most recently it was played at the end of the Minority report trailer.
Ironicly "Bishop's Countdown" from the CD is not used in the Aliens movie, they repeat "Riply`s Rescue" for the finale.
As for music in trailers. Lots a "Borrowed" from other films. The Robocop theme, Backdraft etc the music from those are used in trailers for other movies.
Originally posted by Deadite666
I love the Die Hard music - the adaptations of Ode to Joy. Does anyone know where I can get it (cheap)?
Die Hard 2 and 3 are fairly easy to get hold of but the content of both is a little disappointing IMHO.
The original Die Hard soundtrack was released once but now seems to have vanished from the face of the planet, I know, I have been trying to find one for a while now.
Could try Ebay......
Bishop's Countdown IS used - I just checked, though apart from the fanfare at the start it's mostly buried under SFX - as the ship flees to exploding power station. The Queen/Bishop faceoff/tear-up uses music from earlier in the film. Isn't the same piece played about 5 times? It's been a while since I checked the liner notes.
As for music from other films played in trailers here are some of my all time faves...
Romeo and Juliet's "Escape from Mantua" in The X-Files movie trailer (as the glacier starts breaking apart)
Elfman's Planet of the Apes "Main Titles" in Star Trek: Nemesis and Spider-Man
The World Is Not Enough's "Elektra's Theme" in the first Die Another Day teaser (though this re-using from the Bond library happens all the time - this was just a more obscure choice than the usual 'let's pick a Bond theme remix')
And the Star Wars trailers use all sorts, but most obscurely the end of the AOTC "Clone War" trailer used the "Forest Battle" concert suite from the Return of the Jedi soundtrack and wasn't actually heard in ROTJ.
I need to stop listening to soundtracks and get out more.
Originally posted by McD
It's been an odd year for him though. It hasn't been said in so many words as far as I know, but I get the feeling he 'left' the AOTC project incomplete (for whatever reason). Huge chunks (it felt like 30 mins +, towards the end), were repeated from earlier scores - not even re-orchestrated - just repeated verbatim. I'm not even sure if they were re-recorded!
I'm sure I heard somewhere that Lucas didn't like some of the music that Williams had written for the big fight at the end, so just used the end of Phantom Menace instead for whatever reason. Similarly at the end of the End Credits, on the CD, the Across the Stars theme changes into the Imperial March breifly, but this doesn't happen in the End Credits of the movie. Which is a shame, as it sounds great.
Originally posted by Fred2002
And James Horner again:
Aliens and Star Trek II - Bizarrely similiar!
And for some reason part of the last bit of the Aliens soundtrack is in Die Hard!
If we are talking about similar sounding bits of James Horner, then Star Trek II is very similar indeed to Battle Beyond the Stars.
I'm sure the Aliens soundtrack turning up in Die Hard is discussed on the Die Hard commentary. As mentioned up thread it does get around a bit.
Originally posted by Deadite666
I love the Die Hard music - the adaptations of Ode to Joy. Does anyone know where I can get it (cheap)?
I've used www.soundtrackcollector.com in the past for getting hold of OOP soundtracks.
Originally posted by Liggur
As for music in trailers. Lots a "Borrowed" from other films. The Robocop theme, Backdraft etc the music from those are used in trailers for other movies.
The most bizarre use of 'Backdraft' is the the Japanese cookery show 'Iron Chef.' Which is many many many times more entertaining than any cookery show I've seem in this country.
does this mean that someone else has adapted the original score from philosophers stone??? or is this actually a john williams score?
Answers:
John Williams has actually composed some enw music aswell as the original theme for this new film, but Ross also did some additional original music... :)
Answers:
cool
Answers:
It sounded very "Star Wars" like in places, specially on the broomstick chase.
Answers:
Originally posted by Liggur
It sounded very "Star Wars" like in places, specially on the broomstick chase.
I thought that bit sounded a little like the flying bike scene from ET.
Answers:
check this out about john williams and his music.
http://www.tachyon-tv.co.uk/archives/news5.htm
Answers:
Originally posted by Homer J
I thought that bit sounded a little like the flying bike scene from ET.
I thought that as well
Answers:
Yup - as has often been remarked on - John Williams stuff all sounds pretty much the same.
Answers:
Yup - as has often been remarked on - John Williams stuff all sounds pretty much the same.
You might as well say that all Van Gogh's paintings look pretty much the same.
Any form of art created by the same person is going to have signature elements that identify the artist.
But take (for example) Close Encounters of the Third Kind, Jaws and Raiders of the Lost Ark - there is no way that you can claim those scores sound the same as each other. :nuts:
Answers:
Didn't Howard Shore do the first one?
Answers:
Williams repeats himself less than many of the other major composers (film and otherwise). But yes, there are the odd similarities, and a few are present in Chamber of Secrets (although having someone 'adapting' his work clouds the issue). It's a shame he's gone that route as we all know how good he is at sequels - nothing short of the best ever! Star Wars? Pah, just listen to The Empire Strikes Back. Jaws? The score to the sequel is, if anything, even better.
It's been an odd year for him though. It hasn't been said in so many words as far as I know, but I get the feeling he 'left' the AOTC project incomplete (for whatever reason). Huge chunks (it felt like 30 mins +, towards the end), were repeated from earlier scores - not even re-orchestrated - just repeated verbatim. I'm not even sure if they were re-recorded!
And then... he does the same thing on Harry Potter II, claiming he only ever intended to work a little bit on it! Very strange. Only his old pal Spielberg gets full attention for his two flicks this year.
Liggur is right... the 'broomstick chase' did feature some Star Wars quotes. It began with a bit of 'Duel of the Fates' (TPM), and finished with a touch from the Hoth Battle in Empire Strikes Back. I'd guess that Williams himself composed this piece, although it's really hard to tell what he did and what Ross finished for him (Ross has been Williams' assistant for a while, I believe).
Also check out the scene where the car follows the train track. It's musically almost identical to the scene in Superman The Movie when a young Clark Kent does the same thing running alongside a track. Is it Williams repeating himself, Williams having a musical joke, or Ross doing a little tribute? No idea, but I'd guess it's one of the latter two.
Answers:
Originally posted by Captain_Chaos
Didn't Howard Shore do the first one?
He sure did.
And you may also have heard that Christopher Lee wont be reprising his role as Saruman in LOTR III. Richard Harris is tipped to replace him.
Answers:
I thought the score for the Philosopher's Stone was exactly the same as Home Alone.:eek:
Answers:
Originally posted by Captain_Chaos
Didn't Howard Shore do the first one?
no, he did lord of the rings, williams did potter
Answers:
When I first heard his trailer music for Philosophers Stone I thought it was a piece of John Williams music from Witches of Eastwick..and the first time I listened to Howard Shores score for Fellowship of the Ring, Carter Burwells theme from Millers Crossing immediately came to mind.. a lot of composers are influenced by each other (read Marc Shaimans notes in The Addams Family soundtrack in relation for Mr. Elman)..they also have a definite musical mood per score..e.g. Danny Elfman sci-fi humour (MIB, Mars Attacks)..pretty similar, contrasts with his more 'fantasy' scores (Scrooged, Edward Scissorhands) and comic book style (Batman, Darkman, Spiderman).
John Williams Hook and Home Alone for example are more children based scores, he brings his darker side out in scores for the likes of Empire Strikes Back and Jaws..where does Harry Potter fit into all this? Depends on which one you watch..sequel or original.
Answers:
John Williams has been ripping off his own music for years. A friend lent me a compilation CD of his work, and it's surprising how often the same themes crop up.
Answers:
Originally posted by Whiggles
John Williams has been ripping off his own music for years. A friend lent me a compilation CD of his work, and it's surprising how often the same themes crop up.
Surprising? if you listen to a compilation CD of any composer you'd find that its de rigeur to 'rip yourself off' stylistically speaking.
Compare for example..Maurice Jarre:
Ryan's Daughter
Passage to India
Sound familiar?
Danny Elfman:
Batman Returns
Scrooged
James Horner:
A Beautiful Mind
Bi-centennial Man
Even my fiancée, who's not a movie buff, can tell an Elfman score a mile away.
Answers:
Originally posted by Whiggles
John Williams has been ripping off his own music for years. A friend lent me a compilation CD of his work, and it's surprising how often the same themes crop up.
The Man is a genius! He has had the more Oscar Nominations than anyone and they were fully justified, as pointed out before a music score is an art form so there will be similaraties with his most popular peices that find there way onto compilations because there contain a certain mood that people like and find familiar.
And to use the word "ripping off"! What to you think he does, sits in his house and when Spielberg or Lucas ask for a score he goes I shan't bother i'll just use the same peice of music I used in raiders or empire?
Answers:
And James Horner again:
Aliens and Star Trek II - Bizarrely similiar!
And for some reason part of the last bit of the Aliens soundtrack is in Die Hard!
Answers:
As far as I'm aware, although 'quotes' have cropped up now and then, Williams has never recycled a melody or a theme. James Horner and Hans Zimmer have, although the instances have probably been exagerrated. But Morricone does it all the time - he can give you five minutes, note for note.
Answers:
Originally posted by Si b
The Man is a genius! He has had the more Oscar Nominations than anyone and they were fully justified, as pointed out before a music score is an art form so there will be similaraties with his most popular peices that find there way onto compilations because there contain a certain mood that people like and find familiar.
And to use the word "ripping off"! What to you think he does, sits in his house and when Spielberg or Lucas ask for a score he goes I shan't bother i'll just use the same peice of music I used in raiders or empire?
williams is a genius. he has a style of his own, and inevitably some segments are going to remind u of other scores he has done.
likewise for other composers.
Answers:
Originally posted by Si b
And to use the word "ripping off"! What to you think he does, sits in his house and when Spielberg or Lucas ask for a score he goes I shan't bother i'll just use the same peice of music I used in raiders or empire? Okay, perhaps "ripping off" was a bit too strong, but I do think he re-uses the same material a great deal. I've no idea whether he does it consciously or not, but I think that's beside the point. For me, the point is that his music is not exactly the most varied I've ever heard.
Answers:
Re: the last part of the Aliens OST being in Die Hard
I can't say I've ever noticed - but it's a distinct possibility. That piece - "Bishop's Countdown" - has been used in action movie trailers for years. Most recently it was played at the end of the Minority report trailer.
I love the Die Hard music - the adaptations of Ode to Joy. Does anyone know where I can get it (cheap)?
Answers:
Originally posted by Deadite666
Re: the last part of the Aliens OST being in Die Hard
I can't say I've ever noticed - but it's a distinct possibility. That piece - "Bishop's Countdown" - has been used in action movie trailers for years. Most recently it was played at the end of the Minority report trailer.
Ironicly "Bishop's Countdown" from the CD is not used in the Aliens movie, they repeat "Riply`s Rescue" for the finale.
As for music in trailers. Lots a "Borrowed" from other films. The Robocop theme, Backdraft etc the music from those are used in trailers for other movies.
Answers:
Originally posted by Deadite666
I love the Die Hard music - the adaptations of Ode to Joy. Does anyone know where I can get it (cheap)?
Die Hard 2 and 3 are fairly easy to get hold of but the content of both is a little disappointing IMHO.
The original Die Hard soundtrack was released once but now seems to have vanished from the face of the planet, I know, I have been trying to find one for a while now.
Could try Ebay......
Answers:
Bishop's Countdown IS used - I just checked, though apart from the fanfare at the start it's mostly buried under SFX - as the ship flees to exploding power station. The Queen/Bishop faceoff/tear-up uses music from earlier in the film. Isn't the same piece played about 5 times? It's been a while since I checked the liner notes.
As for music from other films played in trailers here are some of my all time faves...
Romeo and Juliet's "Escape from Mantua" in The X-Files movie trailer (as the glacier starts breaking apart)
Elfman's Planet of the Apes "Main Titles" in Star Trek: Nemesis and Spider-Man
The World Is Not Enough's "Elektra's Theme" in the first Die Another Day teaser (though this re-using from the Bond library happens all the time - this was just a more obscure choice than the usual 'let's pick a Bond theme remix')
And the Star Wars trailers use all sorts, but most obscurely the end of the AOTC "Clone War" trailer used the "Forest Battle" concert suite from the Return of the Jedi soundtrack and wasn't actually heard in ROTJ.
I need to stop listening to soundtracks and get out more.
Answers:
Originally posted by McD
It's been an odd year for him though. It hasn't been said in so many words as far as I know, but I get the feeling he 'left' the AOTC project incomplete (for whatever reason). Huge chunks (it felt like 30 mins +, towards the end), were repeated from earlier scores - not even re-orchestrated - just repeated verbatim. I'm not even sure if they were re-recorded!
I'm sure I heard somewhere that Lucas didn't like some of the music that Williams had written for the big fight at the end, so just used the end of Phantom Menace instead for whatever reason. Similarly at the end of the End Credits, on the CD, the Across the Stars theme changes into the Imperial March breifly, but this doesn't happen in the End Credits of the movie. Which is a shame, as it sounds great.
Answers:
Originally posted by Fred2002
And James Horner again:
Aliens and Star Trek II - Bizarrely similiar!
And for some reason part of the last bit of the Aliens soundtrack is in Die Hard!
If we are talking about similar sounding bits of James Horner, then Star Trek II is very similar indeed to Battle Beyond the Stars.
I'm sure the Aliens soundtrack turning up in Die Hard is discussed on the Die Hard commentary. As mentioned up thread it does get around a bit.
Answers:
Originally posted by Deadite666
I love the Die Hard music - the adaptations of Ode to Joy. Does anyone know where I can get it (cheap)?
I've used www.soundtrackcollector.com in the past for getting hold of OOP soundtracks.
Answers:
Originally posted by Liggur
As for music in trailers. Lots a "Borrowed" from other films. The Robocop theme, Backdraft etc the music from those are used in trailers for other movies.
The most bizarre use of 'Backdraft' is the the Japanese cookery show 'Iron Chef.' Which is many many many times more entertaining than any cookery show I've seem in this country.
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