Question:
Was playing one of my fav DVDs Saving Private Ryan on my new widescreen TV when I noticed this ghosting effect on the screen - I've watched this film dozens of times and never noticed it before - I was begining to think there was something wrong with my new TV but when I connected to my old TV the same problem existed.
It's hard to describe but parts of the screen (in near vertical lines / bands, though not always along the whole height of the screen) go very pale / white / ghost like.
This is only really noticeable in one particular scene at the end of the film when one of the US soldiers points his gun at a group of nazis all with there hands up...because of this effect it looks like all the nazis are puppets on strings as white ghost like lines extend from their bodies to the top of the screen.
Likewise as the soldier moves his gun up and down this ghost like flaring trails the gun's movements. As the scene continues large bits of the screen become very pale almost bisecting the Soldiers face...?
Yet when the film then pans over to Tom Hanks dieing on the bridge, all returns to normal?
As I've said I've never noticed this before, it does it on both tellies in the same place, but looking atthe disc it doesn't look noticeably scratched?
Any ideas? If it is caused by minor scratches on the disc is there anything that can be done about it?
:confused:
I take it that it's not doing it on any other discs? Best thing to do in this situation is to identify where the fault is as it may be your dvd player. Can you try the disc in another machine? If it still does it then it must be the disc and unfortunately I don't think there's anything that can be done other that possibly contact the manufacturers and see if they might consider the disc faulty and replace it.
SPR has smear effects that are intentional, sounds like it could be one of these. They tried to emulate film cameras from that time, and these effects were emulated (if i recall correctly). Another point to check is when they storm the beach, on top of the cliff the fire smears into the sky also. If this is the same same effect then I would say it's definately that, there is nothing wrong with your SPR dvd, and you are just noticing it because of your new TV.
EDIT: To clarify, a scratched DVD would not cause this effect. The only other cause is a SCART connection having noise on it, through other devices connected to the TV. However, I do think this might be an effect that was intentional. If you want though, unplug all other devices and check again.
Paul / Jowser
thanks for the comments...
To clarify I've played the disc on my PC and the effects are the same so don't think it's the DVD, scart cables.
I've connected the DVD to the new and old TV and the effects are the same so don't think it's the TVs.
I would have noticed this effect before and it doesn't happen (as far as I've noticed), in any other part of the film so don't think it's part of the camera work.
It's so unusual / noticeable that I can only assume it's the disc. I will try and find someone who's also got SPR and try their DVD in my machine.
As it's hard to describe I've been analy retentive enough to take a couple of digital photos to highlight the worst bits - so if you were interested I could email them to you FYI..
Let me know
Cheers
There's nothing wrong with any of your equipment or the disc. The vertical streaks are 100% intentional; every copy of the disc made has them, you just haven't noticed them before. There are visual effects like this scattered throughout the film if you look for them: some subtle, some not.
Janusz Kaminski (SPR cinematographer) in a 1998 interview with the magazine American Cinematographer about the shooting style used for Saving Private Ryan:
I also used another technique that Doug Milsome [BSC] utilized on Full Metal Jacket [see AC Sept. 1987] where you throw the camera’s shutter out of sync to create a streaking effect from the top to the bottom of the frame. It’s a very interesting effect, but it’s also scary because there’s no way back [once you shoot with it]. It looked great when there were highlights on the soldier’s helmets or epaulets because they streaked just a little bit. The amount of streaking depended on the lighting contrast. If it was really sunny, for instance, the streaking became too much. However, if it was overcast with some little highlights, it looked really beautiful. The streaking also looks fantastic with fire, and that’s what Milsome primarily used it for in Full Metal Jacket."
Kaminski employed Panavision Platinum and Panastar cameras throughout the Private Ryan shoot, and had Samuelson Film Services in London prepare one unit with a purposely mistimed shutter in order to create the described streaking effect. Used in combination with a narrow shutter, however, the effect was negated as the shortened shutter interval fell within the moment that the film was in its stationary position. Due to this anomaly, however, the "streaking" camera could also be used for normal shooting provided that the shutter was set between 45 and 90 degrees.
Note that the sequence you describe (Upham immediately after he shoots one of the German prisoners then releases those remaining) has flames from a burning building in the right quarter of the frame extending upward to very the top of the frame.
This is one of the legendary DVD picture quality questions, along with Why is my copy of The Matrix so green? . Both have simple answers: they're supposed to look that way.
Adam
Originally posted by Adam Barratt
This is one of the legendary DVD picture quality questions, along with Why is my copy of The Matrix so green? . Both have simple answers: they're supposed to look that way.
Adam
Thanks for your help...
I am a moron - and a blind moron at that! I borrowed a mate's copy today and low and behold - exactly the same effect - doh!
I can't belive I hadn't noticed this before especially as this is in my top 5 films of all time and have watched in dozens of times - In hindsight the scene directly after Upham shooting the nazi is probably made more poignant by the 'ghosting effect' but not quite sure of the benefit of the preceeding bit by hey that's art...now if only I could work out why my copy of the matrix is so green???? ;)
It's hard to describe but parts of the screen (in near vertical lines / bands, though not always along the whole height of the screen) go very pale / white / ghost like.
This is only really noticeable in one particular scene at the end of the film when one of the US soldiers points his gun at a group of nazis all with there hands up...because of this effect it looks like all the nazis are puppets on strings as white ghost like lines extend from their bodies to the top of the screen.
Likewise as the soldier moves his gun up and down this ghost like flaring trails the gun's movements. As the scene continues large bits of the screen become very pale almost bisecting the Soldiers face...?
Yet when the film then pans over to Tom Hanks dieing on the bridge, all returns to normal?
As I've said I've never noticed this before, it does it on both tellies in the same place, but looking atthe disc it doesn't look noticeably scratched?
Any ideas? If it is caused by minor scratches on the disc is there anything that can be done about it?
:confused:
Answers:
I take it that it's not doing it on any other discs? Best thing to do in this situation is to identify where the fault is as it may be your dvd player. Can you try the disc in another machine? If it still does it then it must be the disc and unfortunately I don't think there's anything that can be done other that possibly contact the manufacturers and see if they might consider the disc faulty and replace it.
Answers:
SPR has smear effects that are intentional, sounds like it could be one of these. They tried to emulate film cameras from that time, and these effects were emulated (if i recall correctly). Another point to check is when they storm the beach, on top of the cliff the fire smears into the sky also. If this is the same same effect then I would say it's definately that, there is nothing wrong with your SPR dvd, and you are just noticing it because of your new TV.
EDIT: To clarify, a scratched DVD would not cause this effect. The only other cause is a SCART connection having noise on it, through other devices connected to the TV. However, I do think this might be an effect that was intentional. If you want though, unplug all other devices and check again.
Answers:
Paul / Jowser
thanks for the comments...
To clarify I've played the disc on my PC and the effects are the same so don't think it's the DVD, scart cables.
I've connected the DVD to the new and old TV and the effects are the same so don't think it's the TVs.
I would have noticed this effect before and it doesn't happen (as far as I've noticed), in any other part of the film so don't think it's part of the camera work.
It's so unusual / noticeable that I can only assume it's the disc. I will try and find someone who's also got SPR and try their DVD in my machine.
As it's hard to describe I've been analy retentive enough to take a couple of digital photos to highlight the worst bits - so if you were interested I could email them to you FYI..
Let me know
Cheers
Answers:
There's nothing wrong with any of your equipment or the disc. The vertical streaks are 100% intentional; every copy of the disc made has them, you just haven't noticed them before. There are visual effects like this scattered throughout the film if you look for them: some subtle, some not.
Janusz Kaminski (SPR cinematographer) in a 1998 interview with the magazine American Cinematographer about the shooting style used for Saving Private Ryan:
I also used another technique that Doug Milsome [BSC] utilized on Full Metal Jacket [see AC Sept. 1987] where you throw the camera’s shutter out of sync to create a streaking effect from the top to the bottom of the frame. It’s a very interesting effect, but it’s also scary because there’s no way back [once you shoot with it]. It looked great when there were highlights on the soldier’s helmets or epaulets because they streaked just a little bit. The amount of streaking depended on the lighting contrast. If it was really sunny, for instance, the streaking became too much. However, if it was overcast with some little highlights, it looked really beautiful. The streaking also looks fantastic with fire, and that’s what Milsome primarily used it for in Full Metal Jacket."
Kaminski employed Panavision Platinum and Panastar cameras throughout the Private Ryan shoot, and had Samuelson Film Services in London prepare one unit with a purposely mistimed shutter in order to create the described streaking effect. Used in combination with a narrow shutter, however, the effect was negated as the shortened shutter interval fell within the moment that the film was in its stationary position. Due to this anomaly, however, the "streaking" camera could also be used for normal shooting provided that the shutter was set between 45 and 90 degrees.
Note that the sequence you describe (Upham immediately after he shoots one of the German prisoners then releases those remaining) has flames from a burning building in the right quarter of the frame extending upward to very the top of the frame.
This is one of the legendary DVD picture quality questions, along with Why is my copy of The Matrix so green? . Both have simple answers: they're supposed to look that way.
Adam
Answers:
Originally posted by Adam Barratt
This is one of the legendary DVD picture quality questions, along with Why is my copy of The Matrix so green? . Both have simple answers: they're supposed to look that way.
Adam
Thanks for your help...
I am a moron - and a blind moron at that! I borrowed a mate's copy today and low and behold - exactly the same effect - doh!
I can't belive I hadn't noticed this before especially as this is in my top 5 films of all time and have watched in dozens of times - In hindsight the scene directly after Upham shooting the nazi is probably made more poignant by the 'ghosting effect' but not quite sure of the benefit of the preceeding bit by hey that's art...now if only I could work out why my copy of the matrix is so green???? ;)
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