Question:
where can i get one people ?
I have been to Currys commet etc....and the sales people dont have any.....they sold my sister a bog standard phono lead and claimed it was a digital lead ?
I am connecting a Pghillips 32 (DD5.1 sound) brand new TV to a dvd played (both with digital coaxial)
Everywhere I tried either didn't have one, or it cost a bomb.
Have a look at cardman.co.uk - it was cheap as chips, and the coaxial cable was pretty good to me
A standard phono lead will work perfectly well as it is coaxial. Digital signals do not require any fancy high quality cables.
sorry but I dont agree....i am lead to beleive they are completely different......
I have tried a phono and it is not recognised....
Moreover spoke to an audio shop and they said a phono lead will not work....
phono only sends an analogue stereo signal. I suppose this can be used to achieve pro logic (as it manipulates a stereo signal to achieve the pseudo surround sound) - but it doesn't send a surround 5:1 signal - you need the coaxial
thank you avid fan.....
I am glad to see someone actually knows what they are talking about,.....
I wouldn't go that far!!
:)
I think you may be getting confused a bit guys. A standard phono cable (single) will work as a digital coaxial cable perfectly well, but you need to connect it from the digital out to the digital in.
Currys were dead right, although I expect they were also charging enough for the phono lead.
To make sure, use a 75ohm phono lead, such as those sold to carry composite video from camcorders etc, etc.
Originally posted by Celtic
sorry but I dont agree....i am lead to beleive they are completely different......
No, exactly the same thing (75ohm recommended)
I have tried a phono and it is not recognised....
Could be a weak cable, but it should be recognised.
Moreover spoke to an audio shop and they said a phono lead will not work....
Can you tell us who this is, so that I can phone them up and laugh at their incompetence and also publicly shame them here as not knowing their a from their e :)
Just is on the money, any 75-ohm screened cable is just the ticket.
FYI, I culled the text below from Google recently -
=============================================
From: Arny Krueger (arnyk@pop3free.com)
Subject: Krueger and Nousaine Beaten With a Coat Hanger!
Newsgroups: rec.audio.opinion
View: Complete Thread (10 articles) | Original Format
Date: 2000-12-24 03:18:21 PST
Looks like someone beat Tom Nousaine and I to the punch with a Coat Hanger wire listening test. ;-)
Please see http://www.magnani.net/~al/DigitalWireLabTest.html :
"So just to recap this thing to death, we had: The professional Sony S7000TP reference DVD player, going to a 20 year old, ugly green, RCA patch cord which was cut in two. On one side of the green RCA I soldered a blue painted wire hanger to the shield and another to the center conductor. I soldered the other ends of the wire hangers to the other half of the ugly green RCA patch cord. We then clipped the alligator clips with thin wire to the centers and shields of the RCA connectors of my cable and of the Canare cable, and then plugged the other XLR-balanced side of the Canare into the Dolby Labs decoder. I honestly did not know how badly we would be rolling errors on this one... and with open, scientific minds, we played a DVD... "
Obviously, this guy cheated. No rust on the wire! ;-)
"Are you all sitting down? Good. We played the King Crimson Deja VROOM DVD for over fifteen minutes with this configuration and not only did it sound good, but the Dolby Decoder reported ZERO errors... Did you all get that ok? ZERO, nadda, nihil, zippo, nothing, none... error-free. Given that, there was not much point in trying the higher quality cables I had brought with me."
"Conclusion: IT DOES NOT MATTER WHAT YOU USE FOR YOUR DIGITAL CABLE CONNECTION BETWEEN YOUR DVD PLAYER AND YOUR PROCESSOR... YOU CAN BASICALLY USE ANYTHING THAT LOOKS ELECTRICALLY LIKE METAL. IT WILL WORK JUST FINE. (Between the coax connectors that is... I have not successfully used the wire hangers on the tos-link optical connectors... yet...) If you like you can hook the shield on one side to one of your Rodan bronze statues, and the other shield to somewhere else on the statue, and then hook the center conductors to another Rodan bronze, and it will work JUST FINE. The sonic clarity will be stunning, as well as visually pleasing."
Obviously, it was the blue paint!
==============================================
:lol:
..wouldn't you just love to subject the What Hi-Fi crew to a blind showdown of their precious Van Der Hull and QED versus a coat hanger?!.. and watch their smiles vanish when all is revealed!
Yeah, and then they can give us a bronze vs. brass vs. pig iron statuettes supertest. Can't wait...
...will have to. Never going to occur. Coat Hanger and Statue makers are unlikely to pay the same advertising rates ;)
Mike.
Flimber: I was going to link to that in my post, but didn't have time to google it up. Cheers!
I got one from www.beyondhifi for about 5-6 notes. Does the job quite nicely.
Tim, Just copy and paste it for the next time this thread turns up. Give it a couple of days...
Mike.
we will wait and see......I'll tr it with a standard cable tonight ...and if it does not work...any smart arses are welcome to come and show me where I am going wrong....
cheers all !
The whole point of digital is that unlike analogue, even relatively large variation in the signal from whats sent to whats recieved make no difference, as long as the reciever can still tell the difference between "0" and "1" it is still a perfect copy of what was sent.
i got my digital coax cable for connectin g my dvd to my amp from richer sounds cos me £20 though
Sevenoaks sell a CableTalk one for £15
I don't know about your player but on my old Samsung 709 the defaults for outputs were PCM which sends a digital stereo signal that most decoders will recognise as stereo/pro-logic.
If the lead isn't working you may need to go into the audio setting on your DVD player and set the digital output to "bitstream".
I bought a £20 digital lead on the "advice" of a hifi store. Being a newbie I didn't think to try a normal phono lead (or a coat hanger) first - would have saved £20 :( I've tried a comparison beteen a normal lead and "digital" lead and there is no difference :(
When I first got my DVD, I used a standard audio phono lead, worked well and I never noticed a problem, switched to a digital one and it did make a slight difference, not much, don't know why but it definitely did. I put it down to the fact the shielding was better and perhaps that had some effect on the amp circuits by providing better grounding, also the electrical connection was definitely better since you could tighten the plug onto the amp.
What HiFi always claim it's down to error correction, but I know digital is supposed to be perfect, but if that's the case what's the point to players doing 8x oversampling or whatever, if it got perfect data first time it reads the track?
mike
Mike, you will have noticed a very, very slight improvement most likely because the digital cable was 75ohm, almost certainly not because it was 'digital'. The increase in quality can only be due to the data getting through the cable perfectly (ie with no errors) any errors and compensation takes place, possibly resulting in a tiny quality drop and at worst, drop outs or no signal detected.
The 8x oversampling is due to the way that laser based players read discs (cd, dvd etc). Oversampling takes multiple readings of a section and then takes the best average of them to come up with the most likely to be correct sample. CDs are prone to scratches and dirt, which can make the player mis-read the smaller pits for longer ones and vice versa. Once the average has been agreed, the data is streamed out over the cable. It is at this point that perfection is often (wrongly) declared. But it should be beyond the point of audible detection.
I have been to Currys commet etc....and the sales people dont have any.....they sold my sister a bog standard phono lead and claimed it was a digital lead ?
I am connecting a Pghillips 32 (DD5.1 sound) brand new TV to a dvd played (both with digital coaxial)
Answers:
Everywhere I tried either didn't have one, or it cost a bomb.
Have a look at cardman.co.uk - it was cheap as chips, and the coaxial cable was pretty good to me
Answers:
A standard phono lead will work perfectly well as it is coaxial. Digital signals do not require any fancy high quality cables.
Answers:
sorry but I dont agree....i am lead to beleive they are completely different......
I have tried a phono and it is not recognised....
Moreover spoke to an audio shop and they said a phono lead will not work....
Answers:
phono only sends an analogue stereo signal. I suppose this can be used to achieve pro logic (as it manipulates a stereo signal to achieve the pseudo surround sound) - but it doesn't send a surround 5:1 signal - you need the coaxial
Answers:
thank you avid fan.....
I am glad to see someone actually knows what they are talking about,.....
Answers:
I wouldn't go that far!!
:)
Answers:
I think you may be getting confused a bit guys. A standard phono cable (single) will work as a digital coaxial cable perfectly well, but you need to connect it from the digital out to the digital in.
Currys were dead right, although I expect they were also charging enough for the phono lead.
To make sure, use a 75ohm phono lead, such as those sold to carry composite video from camcorders etc, etc.
Answers:
Originally posted by Celtic
sorry but I dont agree....i am lead to beleive they are completely different......
No, exactly the same thing (75ohm recommended)
I have tried a phono and it is not recognised....
Could be a weak cable, but it should be recognised.
Moreover spoke to an audio shop and they said a phono lead will not work....
Can you tell us who this is, so that I can phone them up and laugh at their incompetence and also publicly shame them here as not knowing their a from their e :)
Answers:
Just is on the money, any 75-ohm screened cable is just the ticket.
FYI, I culled the text below from Google recently -
=============================================
From: Arny Krueger (arnyk@pop3free.com)
Subject: Krueger and Nousaine Beaten With a Coat Hanger!
Newsgroups: rec.audio.opinion
View: Complete Thread (10 articles) | Original Format
Date: 2000-12-24 03:18:21 PST
Looks like someone beat Tom Nousaine and I to the punch with a Coat Hanger wire listening test. ;-)
Please see http://www.magnani.net/~al/DigitalWireLabTest.html :
"So just to recap this thing to death, we had: The professional Sony S7000TP reference DVD player, going to a 20 year old, ugly green, RCA patch cord which was cut in two. On one side of the green RCA I soldered a blue painted wire hanger to the shield and another to the center conductor. I soldered the other ends of the wire hangers to the other half of the ugly green RCA patch cord. We then clipped the alligator clips with thin wire to the centers and shields of the RCA connectors of my cable and of the Canare cable, and then plugged the other XLR-balanced side of the Canare into the Dolby Labs decoder. I honestly did not know how badly we would be rolling errors on this one... and with open, scientific minds, we played a DVD... "
Obviously, this guy cheated. No rust on the wire! ;-)
"Are you all sitting down? Good. We played the King Crimson Deja VROOM DVD for over fifteen minutes with this configuration and not only did it sound good, but the Dolby Decoder reported ZERO errors... Did you all get that ok? ZERO, nadda, nihil, zippo, nothing, none... error-free. Given that, there was not much point in trying the higher quality cables I had brought with me."
"Conclusion: IT DOES NOT MATTER WHAT YOU USE FOR YOUR DIGITAL CABLE CONNECTION BETWEEN YOUR DVD PLAYER AND YOUR PROCESSOR... YOU CAN BASICALLY USE ANYTHING THAT LOOKS ELECTRICALLY LIKE METAL. IT WILL WORK JUST FINE. (Between the coax connectors that is... I have not successfully used the wire hangers on the tos-link optical connectors... yet...) If you like you can hook the shield on one side to one of your Rodan bronze statues, and the other shield to somewhere else on the statue, and then hook the center conductors to another Rodan bronze, and it will work JUST FINE. The sonic clarity will be stunning, as well as visually pleasing."
Obviously, it was the blue paint!
==============================================
Answers:
:lol:
..wouldn't you just love to subject the What Hi-Fi crew to a blind showdown of their precious Van Der Hull and QED versus a coat hanger?!.. and watch their smiles vanish when all is revealed!
Answers:
Yeah, and then they can give us a bronze vs. brass vs. pig iron statuettes supertest. Can't wait...
...will have to. Never going to occur. Coat Hanger and Statue makers are unlikely to pay the same advertising rates ;)
Mike.
Answers:
Flimber: I was going to link to that in my post, but didn't have time to google it up. Cheers!
Answers:
I got one from www.beyondhifi for about 5-6 notes. Does the job quite nicely.
Answers:
Tim, Just copy and paste it for the next time this thread turns up. Give it a couple of days...
Mike.
Answers:
we will wait and see......I'll tr it with a standard cable tonight ...and if it does not work...any smart arses are welcome to come and show me where I am going wrong....
cheers all !
Answers:
The whole point of digital is that unlike analogue, even relatively large variation in the signal from whats sent to whats recieved make no difference, as long as the reciever can still tell the difference between "0" and "1" it is still a perfect copy of what was sent.
Answers:
i got my digital coax cable for connectin g my dvd to my amp from richer sounds cos me £20 though
Answers:
Sevenoaks sell a CableTalk one for £15
Answers:
I don't know about your player but on my old Samsung 709 the defaults for outputs were PCM which sends a digital stereo signal that most decoders will recognise as stereo/pro-logic.
If the lead isn't working you may need to go into the audio setting on your DVD player and set the digital output to "bitstream".
I bought a £20 digital lead on the "advice" of a hifi store. Being a newbie I didn't think to try a normal phono lead (or a coat hanger) first - would have saved £20 :( I've tried a comparison beteen a normal lead and "digital" lead and there is no difference :(
Answers:
When I first got my DVD, I used a standard audio phono lead, worked well and I never noticed a problem, switched to a digital one and it did make a slight difference, not much, don't know why but it definitely did. I put it down to the fact the shielding was better and perhaps that had some effect on the amp circuits by providing better grounding, also the electrical connection was definitely better since you could tighten the plug onto the amp.
What HiFi always claim it's down to error correction, but I know digital is supposed to be perfect, but if that's the case what's the point to players doing 8x oversampling or whatever, if it got perfect data first time it reads the track?
mike
Answers:
Mike, you will have noticed a very, very slight improvement most likely because the digital cable was 75ohm, almost certainly not because it was 'digital'. The increase in quality can only be due to the data getting through the cable perfectly (ie with no errors) any errors and compensation takes place, possibly resulting in a tiny quality drop and at worst, drop outs or no signal detected.
The 8x oversampling is due to the way that laser based players read discs (cd, dvd etc). Oversampling takes multiple readings of a section and then takes the best average of them to come up with the most likely to be correct sample. CDs are prone to scratches and dirt, which can make the player mis-read the smaller pits for longer ones and vice versa. Once the average has been agreed, the data is streamed out over the cable. It is at this point that perfection is often (wrongly) declared. But it should be beyond the point of audible detection.
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